That sacon symble is diferent than the one seen in the movie, is it just an animation error? X-BoB58 20:43, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
I suspect the close-up in the movie is correct. Do you have a screencap of it? (My VCD is screwed up for the first several minutes of the BW2 movie.) -Derik 21:45, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
As Sipher noted in his update comment, they aren't Seacons and were never Seacons, so they shouldn't be listed under Seacon (BW). Again, as he noted, they were always referred to as God Neptune as a group. Also, Sipher isn't administration. This is stated for the benefit of X-Bob. --ItsWalky 22:38, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
Thier bio calls them Seacon Pirates http://www.bwtf.com/bws/toys/techspecs/scylle.shtml
Name: Scylle Beast Mode: Mechanical Squid Allegiance: Destron Sub Group: Seacon Pirate Function: Pirate scheme soldier
A female squid transformer. fond of display, proud woman. She feels love with Scuba at first sight. Name is pronounced "S-Kyu-Leh". Armed with Skelaser in mecha-beast-mode and Shi no Nage Kiss (Blowing Kiss of Death) in mecha-beast mode.
- Uhhh, bwtf.com, as fine a site as it is, is not an official source of information....--G.B. Blackrock 22:58, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
He got that form a TFMag, he didn't write that himself, if he did it wouldn't have awful grammer, and this line. "*Special thanks to Takeuchi Shouichi for the God Neptune individual team member names and character descriptions, originally printed in Comic Bon Bon Magazine, August 1998."
- I don't have that source, so I can't say, but it's entirely possible that "Seacon" was added during translation. And for the bajillionth time, please SIGN your statements, X-BoB!--G.B. Blackrock 23:59, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
The burden of proof is on people who insist they're called "Seacons", as I OWN the set, and the word "Seacon" isn't anywhere on their packaging or bio card. So even if, if you find a scan from a Japanese source material that calls them "Seacons", well, whoops, there's still no "Seacons" on the packaging. --M Sipher 01:45, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Wait, you were refering to the toy this whole time!? X-BoB58 01:55, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
- .......... --M Sipher 02:12, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
To whomever re-ordered the list of members alphabeticly- it was put in the order they were presented int he BW guidebook, which seems to reflect the group dynamics. (in other words, the relative order had meaning, which has now been discarded in favor of alphabetizing it.)
I'm putting it back. If you're that attached to alphabetical order, by all means revert it. -Derik 04:07, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Thier Premere epesode was called "Space pirate Seacons" acourding to both BWTF.com and Bigbot.com, take that how you will. X-BoB58 20:01, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
The article says (in the toys section): The complete set of molds (all six members with all accessories) were slated to be released as an exclusive set during Energon as Piranhaking, but as of now remains unreleased.
I'm not sure that this is germane to this article. The Piranhaking toys were not (to the best of my knowledge) considered to be the "God Neptune" characters.--G.B. Blackrock 20:20, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Correct, the Pirahnacons/TFU Seacons were drones like in Masterforce, but the Toy section isn't all about the characters. X-BoB58 20:55, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
- The TFU Seacons were Drones? What? --KilMichaelMcC 21:01, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
- He's referring to the Piranhacons from Universe #3, which for some reason a few people confuse with the Energon exclusive set. He's wrong. --ItsWalky 21:07, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Mabie becuse they have the same names, and both have aquatic alt modes X-BoB58 21:22, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
- Yes, X-Bob, I was there. You're wrong. --ItsWalky 21:50, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
So was I. X-BoB58 22:04, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
X-BoB, you seem to be overzealous and underinformed, as usual. But back to the question at hand. The addition of the Energon Seacons (also called Pirahnacons) seems to be an addition by MSipher, who I usually trust, but again, it does not appear appropriate for this article. Unless I see a reasonable defense (presumably by someone other than X-BoB), I'm thinking to delete that portion.--G.B. Blackrock 22:09, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
- We tend to note all uses of a toy's mold in each guy's entry. For example, Strongarm's toy sections mentions his was used as Energon Strongarm and Timelines Fallback. What continuity they're from or what character they are is not the point of the exercise. --ItsWalky 22:15, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
- Exactly. Check out pretty much any other entry with a full toy section, and mold-partners are listed. It's good information to have, plus it also serves as a nice "oh, by the way, did you know about THIS character?", hopefully getting people to check the links and learn more about the vast multiverse we profess to love. --M Sipher 22:25, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
In other words exactly what I said. just, er, um, more comprahendable and stuff X-BoB58 22:25, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Much as aI hate to chime in in support of x-bob (heh) I also noticed when readign this sectiont hat it was worded confusingly, it seemed to be introducing the PRU set as related to these characters, not just as mold-cousins. I think it needs to be rephrased for clarity to prevent confusion. -Derik 22:30, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
- (The use of the character ":" aids in comprehension, by indenting a paragraph one space for each ":" used. This helps us follow the flow of conversations. Please. Learn it. Use it.)
- Anyway, thanks to all for clearing the matter up as to site policy. Maybe I'm just confused by the language necessary to show that the Seacon molds have been reused inconsistently (with all the parts in some cases, and without them in others). Or perhaps I'm just having trouble knowing what kind of entries to look for. I looked up Swindle (G1), which mentions remolds quite clearly, and when I look from there to Rollbar (G1), it also seems to more clearly designate when molds are used and reused, and in what order.--G.B. Blackrock 22:44, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
I hate to reopen this contested point, but... If the premiere episode for these characters refers to them as Seacons in the episode title... why isn't that good enough? It seems that X-BoB was right on that count, unless all the online guides are copying a mis-translated title from each other. It seems as if the editorial note in the article is willfully ignoring their toon-labelling as Seacons. Was that name for them never used in dialogue? Were they just called "Team God Neptune" or something in the show except for in that title? Haven't people (I'm thinking Walky?) said in the past that toy packaging copy is not "fiction" and ignored it in favor of other sources for other characters? Why would these characters' packaging trump the cartoon? --Steve-o 20:06, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
- For the same reasons we list Smokejumper and Dreadwind with the (RiD) tag, for the same reasons the entires are "Hot Rod" and "Bluestreak" and "Cyclonus (UT)", not "Rodimus Prime" or "Silverstreak" or "Snow Cat". It does all boil down to the toys.
- As for the "fiction", I think you're confusing the argument that the packaging-back backstory should not be included with the comics and cartoons and such.
- --M Sipher 20:26, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
- I don't think Steve-o was talking about the name of the article, he was talking about the body. The text of the article itself seems to dance around the fact that they're called Seacons everywhere but the toy packaging. --ItsWalky 20:57, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
- I'm kind of indifferent on the article's name. I could go either way on it, and with redirects, it doesn't make much difference. Sort of a matter of taste. But I don't buy your argument, Sipher -- I have no idea what Smokejumper/Dreadwind has to do with anything, and the others are all instances of pre-existing characters that got new names later in life. I thought the reason we have no Rodimus Prime article is because this is a character-centric wiki and Rodimus is the same *guy* as Hot Rod, hence no need for a second article. That is... completely unrelated to this all-new set of characters.
- I do agree that packaging backstory shouldn't be merged inappropriately with story from other continuities, but I do think it should have a place on the wiki. It can simply have another heading in the fiction section.
- Regardless, I'm satisfied with the changes you made after my last post, so I'm not actually asking for anything else to be done, except to perhaps explain what you meant in your own previous post.
- --Steve-o 21:33, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
- Simply, the term "Seacon" is a later addition to the characters, as would be the inclusion of Smokejumper/Dreadwind in the TFU fiction, or Hot Rod becoming Rodimus, which we don't reflect in the article names, which is what I thought you were talking about. --M Sipher 21:50, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
- Wow. They're are indeed called the Seacons. (More specifically, the Space Pirate Seacons.) Here's a pic I found from Takara's own catalog:  Evan1975 01:11, 17 August 2006 (UTC)